and here's this piece on dailykos comparing ben to w.
The Great Franklin-Bush debate...in 6 rounds:good times.
Bush: America must not ignore the threat gathering against us. Facing clear evidence of peril, we cannot wait for the final proof, the smoking gun that could come in the form of a mushroom cloud.
Franklin: All wars are follies, very expensive and very mischievous ones. In my opinion, there never was a good war or a bad peace. When will mankind be convinced and agree to settle their difficulties by arbitration?
Bush Health care reform must begin with Medicare; Medicare is the binding commitment of a caring society. We must renew that commitment by giving seniors access to preventive medicine and new drugs that are transforming health care in America.
Franklin: Well done is better than well said.
Bush: There is no "trust fund," just IOUs that I saw firsthand, that future generations will pay---will pay for either in higher taxes, or reduced benefits, or cuts to other critical government programs. The office here in Parkersburg stores those IOUs. They're stacked in a filing cabinet. Imagine---the retirement security for future generations is sitting in a filing cabinet. It's time to strengthen and modernize Social Security for future generations with growing assets that you can control, that you call your own---assets that the government cannot take away.
Franklin: Half a truth is often a great lie.
Bush: The fact that somebody leaked this program [of illegally spying on Americans without a warrant] causes great harm to the United States. There's an enemy out there.
Franklin: Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.
Bush: I'm a uniter, not a divider. I refuse to play the politics of putting people into groups and pitting one group against another.
Franklin: Tricks and treachery are the practice of fools, that don't have brains enough to be honest.
Bush: I'm not going to change my mind.
Franklin: For having lived long, I have experienced many instances of being obliged, by better information or fuller consideration, to change opinions, even on important subjects, which I once thought right but found to be otherwise. ... When you're finished changing, you're finished.
Final score: Bush 0 Franklin 6
That's right---the guy with the cardiovascular system of a teenager just got his clock cleaned by a 300 year-old man.